Mar 31 2008
Wine – A Palatable Investment by Saeed Shah
The first talk at the Smart Expo that I attended was delivered by Saeed Shah, the sales director of Australian Wine Index (AWI).
Australian Wine Index is a fine wine broker which sources and purchases fine Australian wine for investors. They will also help to find suitable storage space for your wine, and advise you on different exit strategies when the time is ripe.
The reasons given by Saeed why we should invest in wine include:
- Wine has outperformed other investments.
- Recent UK report by Wine Asset Managers (WAM)
- Return of 16% over last 7 years
- Wine is a relatively low risk investment.
- Finite commodity
- Limited supply & growing demand
- There is huge growth potential.
- US no.1 wine consumption market in the world
- China 45% growth over the next 10 years
- Global demand
- Auction houses: Christie’s & Sotheby
- “Nuevo Riche” in emerging marketings like China, Russia, Eastern Europe
Wine is an area that I haven’t invested in before as it is something not close to my heart. Even though I was told that I don’t have to be a wine drinker to be an investor, somehow I feel that I would be at a disadvantage when it comes to the product knowledge.
So how exactly do you invest in wine? These are the steps shared with us:
- Selection
- Storage
- Trading
1) Wine selection
- Ratings (Critics) – RPJ’s Wine Advocate
- Regions – South Australia & Margaret River
- Vintage, Vintage and Vintage
- Research
- Strong ties with vineyards
- Build collections with intrinsic value
2) Wine storage
- Home storage – bad idea
- Perishable product
- AWI has a tie-up with Cougar Express Logistics whereby investors can store their wines and have their own individual account
3) Trading
- Exit strategies – Friends, collectors, merchants
- Auctions offer best option
I can’t really elaborate on the points given in the presentation by Australian Wine Index as I’m pretty much a novice when it comes to wine investment.
Would not recommend AWI to anyone. They are only eager to sell you the wine. Any requests to liquidate will lead to a frustrating effort to initiate, let alone closing it! Poor support…..Really regret to invest with them…
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Edwin Reply:
November 13th, 2008 at 11:07 pm
Hmm.. I don’t agree. I have been with AWI since 2002 and sold off half my portfolio for about 80% returns and have purchased more wines since. They provide constant market updates and I have also been to a few of their wine tasting events. Excellent service. I will recommend only AWI to anyone interested in wine investment. My friends have told me many bad comments from other companies, even UK companies.
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Jimmy Reply:
November 13th, 2008 at 11:25 pm
Hi Edwin,
No such service for me as far as sales is concerned…except receiving calls to buy more! I was informed the annual valuation will be out in Nov. Will see what are the recommendations though do not expect much with the current crisis. Maybe my 60k portfolio is “too small” for them
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Edwin Reply:
November 15th, 2008 at 4:57 pm
Hi
Well, seems like you just invested with them not long ago..
Yes, I do receive calls from them often. They will call me to update me on market situations and also to recommend me new wines for my portfolio.
I enjoy such service as I will learn more about what is the best wines for investment. Of course, I don’t always buy every wines that they recommend to me.
Yes, I just received my valuation report and I will say I am extremely satisfied to see profitable results when all my other investments are in negative.. This year is the best proof and assurance for me that wine seems to be the only investment to get profits returns in tough times..
Well, personally, I will recommend to you not to sell any wines in this current situation. As for me, I will definitely not sell any of my portfolio this year and wait until the next valuation report. It will be better to sell after the market recover to see better returns.
Hmm, 60k portfolio is never too small. In fact. I think I buy around 60k worth of wines in total also, and now my whole portfolio is worth more than 100k.
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Eugene Reply:
February 2nd, 2009 at 5:45 pm
Hi Edwin, Jimmy,
Interesting to find your comments regarding AWI. I’ve just invested in a very small portfolio with them today, and frankly speaking I do have my reservations. Wine investment is a totally new thing to me – I’m not very knowledgable with wines (besides drinking =P) so I foresee myself being dependent on my broker. How are your recent valuations doing and may I ask which brokers are looking after your portfolio for you at AWI?
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Hi Edwin,
Nice to hear that your portfolio is profitable. I have yet to received any updates from AWI till date….
Just to mention that I have started investing with them since 2004 and have gone through 4 different wine brokers along the way. High turnover rate?
Nevertheless, I still maintain my opinion that I will not recommend anyone to AWI. Cheers….
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Hi
Well, do not worry. You will be all smiles when you received your valuation report very soon.
Hmm, I have gone through 4 different brokers also and I like the service of my current one. Guess those who stayed on are the really good ones.
Well, once you get your first profits from wines, you will start recommending AWI to everyone just like me. Cheers…
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Hi,
It was interesting to see all the comments about AWI.
Let me share my experience, I was recommended to AWI by a friend of mine about 2 years ago. Initially I was still not sure if I have made the right choice to invest in wine as I was not familiar with the investment initially also. However, when I visited Cougar, I was quite impressed and until last December, AWI sold one of my wines at $225 which I bought at $125 around 2 years back. When I received my check, I felt that my decision to invest was justified.
I do have complains too, whether the group or personal wine tasting event can never be arranged on a weekend which I think will be more appropriate. I also feel my broker always call me when there are new wines which can be quite disturbing whenever I am with a patient but to be fair, I agree that it is their job.
I have some friends who invested in Bordeaux wines and based on their feedback, the lock in period is longer which I personally do not like and I feel they are too pricey as well.
Overall, I still consider myself quite a satisfied investor and is still open to good wines.
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Hi All,
I know NUTS about wines, but I would just like to make a comment / point.
Having paper profits being shown on a statement is very different from being to realise it.
Will AWI guarantee the buyback of your wine portfolio at the valuation price? Or is the valuation price merely an estimate of your portfolio’s value?
I can always say your portfolio is worth 50% more than its purchase price, but when you try to sell it, you are unable to sell at close to the valuation level.
Anyone has successfully liquidate his/her entire portfolio at a huge profit and got back cold hard cash? It’s useless if you say you are able to liquidate your portfolio at 50% profit if you are forced/persuaded to reinvest in another portfolio of wines.
Cheers,
Intheknow
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Hi All,
Sorry to be a spoiltsport, but in my opinion, investing in wine/art is even worse than structured products.
At least for structured products, there is the prospectus which lists out EVERY DETAIL if you bother to read it.
For wine/art, I am perplexed by how the product is actually valued!
Cheers,
Intheknow
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Like InTheKnow, I know nuts about wine investing (or even drinking!) too and as such, will not dabble into it as a form of investment.
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Hi,
Well, as far as I am concerned, like I have mentioned, I have got back my money together with the returns for one of my wine which I have invested for only 2 years which I understand that it takes 3 years to realize the returns.
At least my investments with AWI is not paper profits. As for the rest of my wines, will have to wait till another year before I can comment further. As of now, I can only say that I am quite a satisfied investor.
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Hi Steven,
Getting back $225 for a $125 wine (i am assuming you only traded 1 bottle?) is good, but hardly representative if you still have a $50k portfolio entranched with AWI.
I believe there is no smoke without fire. What Jimmy mentioned could be alarming. They actively encourage investments and yet don’t provide much help on liquidation. If so, it’s very much like an scheme that doesn’t allow withdrawals.
Good luck on your remaining portfolio.
Cheers,
Intheknow
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Jimmy Reply:
February 4th, 2009 at 2:03 pm
Hi all,
Just an update on my portfolio….
Did not get any follow-up call from AWI after receiving valuation report. Called broker in Dec 08 to liquidate 20K of collection for wines with ~20% profit indicated in report. Broken said will call back in 1 week’s time but never do so after 2 weeks. Was told that broken on Christmas vacation till early Jan 09 when I call to check. (customer service???)
Now that Christmas is over, New Year is over AND Chinese New Year is also almost over, have yet to hear from them.
Tired of calling them. Decide to let my wine sit in the warehouse for now….
For those who had profited, congrats!
For those who are invested, good luck!
For those who are thinking to invest, take care….
PS:
I started my investment with AWI in Dec 05. Be prepared to hold for a long period……
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Eugene Reply:
February 4th, 2009 at 5:01 pm
Jimmy,
From the comments from fellow investors like edwin and steven whom have shared their experience, could it be the case that you’ve gotten a lousy broker whos not taking proper care of your portfolio as it should be?
Would you care to share who is your broker over at AWI?
As for liquidation, I believe that if you continue to push for it, you should be able to get back your capital + returns?
Regards,
Eugene
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Jimmy Reply:
February 4th, 2009 at 5:58 pm
Hi Eugene,
As much as I would like to share who is my broker at AWI, I don’t think it is appropriate for me to reveal here….
All I can say is someone very senior and very busy within the sales team.
Wish you best in your investment.
Regards
Jimmy
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Sam Reply:
October 16th, 2009 at 10:10 am
He’s senior so that he could just set priorities to his larger clients and redistribute the clients’ wine to newer, smaller investors…
Better off if they can get additional margin fm those the newer, smaller investors…
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Hi Steven,
I just gotten my first portfolio from AWI a couple of days ago, as well as meeting up with my wine broker to understand more wine investment. In fact, I’m wondering if we are using the same broker as well, because I was told of an example of a recent investment which realized profits similar to yours?
Perhaps you can email me at my email? It would be great we could share our experiences and pointers on wine investment and AWI.
Regards,
Eugene
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My experience with AWI has been really bad. Similar to Jimmy, I have gone through 3 – 4 wine brokers since I invested in 2004. The first broker called me every other week to promote new wines to me, which I had no issue with although I wasn’t ready to put in more investments.
Then the broker left and the subsequent ones were just a series of downhill experiences. Valuation reports never came on time. My broker never returns my phone call, never calls when he promises to, never answers my emails. The only time he looks at liquidating my portfolio is when I track him down on the phone. The phone call would be ended with a nice promise of follow up and monitoring, which, of course, is never realized. This has been my experience trying to liquidate my wine for the past 6 months.
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Hi Intheknow,
I have traded 1 of my wine but of course not just 1 bottle but in a number of cases. I have invested quite a substantial amount with AWI also, I would be glad to listen to comments but I am satisfied so far since I did realized some good returns.
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i will give only one advise… don’t invest with them… if not you will be like me… holding few thousand bottles of wines total i think close to 100k in cougar…. how long can i finish drinking them i wonder…..
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I read with interest on the comments given so far. No offense to anyone but I truly think that investing in luxuries, be it fine art or wine falls within the greater fool theory of investing.
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lioninvestor Reply:
May 12th, 2009 at 11:50 pm
Hi Bernie,
I think other than the greater fool theory, tangible items do help a bit to provide some form of storage of value when there is inflation.
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I have also invested with AWI, and very upset over the experience. Brokers only call to push sales, never about trading off your portfolios. Anyone managed to sell off your collections yourself? care to share your experience?
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Same here. I have requested to have my wines sold since 2008 and until now, nothing has been done. Only have new brokers calling me to sell me wines once in a while.
The so called Trading Director “Andrew Bassett” have been giving me excuses after excuses. Valuation Report stated that my portfolio has gained a 20% profits, but when I want to sell, I was told that I have to sell at 20% loss. Is that logical?
Luckily, I have not bought a large portfolio.
I have intended to withdraw my wines out to drink and enjoy. These brokers are not reliable at all.
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another case of EASY IN.. NO WAY OUT!
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I’m also an AWI investor with the same complaints you guys voiced.
I’m curious, has any of you guys physically seen your wines in the cellar? I took for granted that they are there, but then I realized I cannot assume.
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even if you see wines in the cellar.. how do u know they are yours?
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Hi Kurious,
Yes, I have visited my wines in Menlo before and they are there. You may arrange with Menlo to visit your wines too.
I do not bother about contacting AWI anymore. I will just withdraw out my wines to drink.
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Hi awi investor
Thanks for the information and sharing of your personal experience.
I am looking to other ways to sell my wines, perhaps drink up a few bottles. AWI clearly has NO exit strategy for their investors. full of s.
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so it’s basically buy and drink your stock.
no exit method at all.
so much for a good ‘investment’….
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Kurious,
You are welcome. Just hope their that future prospects will read this and be warned.
I have actually tried approaching wine merchants in Singapore to help sell my wines, but the prices quoted to me is like 50% or less than what I paid for.
That is why I choose to rather withdraw these wines to drink since I don’t have a very large portfolio anyway.
Anyway, good luck to your selling of your wines.
Intheknow,
Yes, you are right. But still I have to count myself lucky that I can at least drink my wines, my friend who invested with UAG will be left with a nice piece of paper. Lucky he never invest a lot also.
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NEVER invest in products with returns TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE.. they are usually schemes which will fall apart eventually.
there is a shiny yellow product in this blog/forum which I am 100% sure falls into this category as well.
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alice Reply:
June 24th, 2009 at 4:25 pm
Geneva gold?
that scheme does sounds fishy… there is no transparency or so-called credibility about the company.
after the minibond and structured notes, i thought we have enough lesson to learn about there is no guarantee or what-so-ever even they state “GUARANTEE” in the product brochure.
better stay alert and not falling into their scam again and again.
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there are still people who fall into such schemes…. sad to say
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when u ask to trade your wine off awi, they will throw you like a ball from one person to another.
from director to manager, to office manager to broker.
so tired of all of these.
no way out.
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I started investing with AWI in 2004, changed at least 4 brokers, best was David Choo but he passed away. That’s the only guy that follow up and share with you his plan on how they will offload your portfolio. Since he left, nothing was done.
Andrew just got a new manager to provide another layer of delay shield. 2.5 months ago, I just signed a sales order to offload partial of my portfolio at a 5% profit, guess what, till now I have not see the damn cheque. And I told them to offload my full portfolio, the new mgr told them she will do it in Sept 09, in my heart I know likely it’s another delay technique again.
I’m trying to go thru all the invoices and contract document to see any misleading or information I can use maybe for legal action against them.
Personally I feel their business model is to solicit investor fund, fund their operation, once in a blue moon, help client to sell their wine, and let the rest of the poor investor stuck with their wine and can’t do much about it while they play their delaying technique.
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Dear Investors, I have the same issue with AWI too, till now not even 1 bottle is sold. AWI is always delaying and giving diffrent excuses now and then. I heard that the Director jeremy kasler is involved with a Timeshare scam in Australia and was given a warning by the Australia government, investors can google his name and you will be able to read the article. I am very worried about my investment with them now since I couldnt sell my wine through them. Any one can advic eme on that issue.
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Would any AWI investors be interested in getting together to brainstorm possible recourse we can take?
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Hi guys,
I felt that I am VERY VERY lucky today. Almost wanted to throw in my money to AWI as well for a “VERY sounded” investment portfolio.
My story started with a lady calling regarding wine survey a month ago, and ended up she recommended to have her colleague to call me up and recommend wine for my consumption. Since I just started with wine and would love to receive some recommendation on the selection which can fits to my taste, so I agreed.
However, after a month time, the call I received from AWI was all about wine investment instead of selling few bottles of wine for my own consumption. The guy kept calling every 1 or 2 days trying to persuade me to invest into the portfolio, which sounds to me is a 200% sure make money investment between 1 to 3 years time.
I believe my greed has almost driven me into the investment scheme, however my last piece of doubt has driven me to search out more and here I am, reading at all the comments from you guys. It all sounds to be that AWI is only doing half of the job for a sound business and no exit strategy.
I wish anyone who has invested into the portfolio is able get their investment back and hope someone can really look into this grey area of the business to avoid more investors from being “frame” into the scam.
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2 hours invested in reading the link below will yield the best returns in your investment:
http://singaporeprofit.com/2007/07/29/new-age-wine-investment-in-singapore/
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Dear All, Below was posted in out wine investment website
Director of Australian Wine Index (S) – Mr Jeremy Kasler, the man they will be chasing when the house of card falls. Australia government bodies have issued a warning against this guy , or doing business with him. BE WARNED!
Warning published by ASIC- Australian securities & Investments Comission. Date published : March 2000
Reference: http://www.asic.gov.au/asic/pdflib.nsf/LookupByFileName/00-115.pdf/$file/00-115.pdf
ASIC WARNS OVER TIMESHARE PROMOTERS
The Australian Securities and Investments Commission (ASIC) today issued a warning
to investors over the activities of Tourism Advisory Group Limited UK (TAG) and Mr
Jeremy Kasler.
ASIC has become aware that TAG and Mr Kasler have been running a timeshare
rental and resale business from an office in Sydney’s Crows Nest, placing
advertisements offering to assist in the rental or resale of timeshare properties in
newspapers across Australia.
Respondents to the advertisements resided primarily in Queensland although large
numbers of enquiries originated in New South Wales and Western Australia.
ASIC is concerned that neither TAG nor Mr Kasler are licensed to deal in securities,
as units in timeshare schemes are considered securities under the Corporations Law.
TAG is also not incorporated or a registered foreign company in Australia.
ASIC NSW General Counsel Jan Redfern warned that people contracting with with
TAG and Mr Kasler may be taking unnecessary risks with their money.
“Because TAG and Mr Kasler are unlicensed and TAG is not registered in Australia,
the protection offered to consumers under the Corporations Law may be reduced.
“People purchasing or selling timeshare units can take two simple steps to protect
themselves:
· When dealing with a company that appears to be based outside of Australia, check
with ASIC to see if the company is a registered foreign company.
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Does any AWI investor want to get together to see if we can launch an investigation or at least raise public awareness about AWI?
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Sam Reply:
October 16th, 2009 at 9:37 am
Yes Kurious I am interested in your idea!
As an oversea investor (am fm HK) with AWI since 2003, it has been proofed to be one of the worst investments I have ever made and I do wish there are alternatives other than shipping my wine back to Hong Kong. *sighs*
Anyway, if you guys really have any plan to get together launch a campaign against AWI to liquidate our investment, please count me in!!!
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Kurious Reply:
October 28th, 2009 at 4:53 pm
Hi Sam
Write me at dr[dot]steward[dot]griffin[at]gmail[dot]com. I’ll reply you with my formal email address.
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Hi,
I am also one of those who invested in AWI since 2005. Through this period, there had been a change of at least 5 wine brokers and they only called to ask me to buy more. I just tried calling AWI to look for the newly assigned broker but is not able to find him. Will try again.
Sigh…I am prepared to write off this investment of close to $30k.
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another link, watch the last page:
http://www.lamrocks.com.au/newsletter/franchises.pdf
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I invested with AWI since 2005,till now nothing sold too. Like what alot of you said, from 1 , they will throw me to another 1. This has been going around since 2008 and nothing happened.
The report about Jeremy actually frighten me. Anyone can give me some ideas what I can do now? I spoke to 1 of my friend who work in a Law firm, he say I can request to have all my money back as there are indications that we might fall into the same scam with this company again as the Boss Jeremy has a history of scam in Australia.
I dont know if I should go ahead with this.
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Oh AWI. Given up hope.DO NOT invest with them, I have been with them for years and none of my wines sold.Saw the article about Jeremy and intend to go and question them tomorrow.
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HI everyone I heard recently 1 whole group of brokers left AWI, are they in some problems?? I called my broker mobile, but his phone off?? Call office, they say will update me with new broker. Anyone know what happened???
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Well, after 5 months from the initial instruction to sell one range of wines, then the cheque has arrived.
Shame they couldn’t do this more quickly, the initial delay was the change of broker (I’m already onto a second one since the one that took the original order to sell) so OK, will accept that as a “shit happens” sort of thing.
The next 3 months…..well, after the initial contract said 4-8 weeks for the monies to be sent, it required weekly checks on where the money was after that time.
The idea is sound, and if they could improve this process then it wouldn’t be too bad, but they really need to sort out (a) the orders to sell and (b)keeping the client up to date on the sales process.
The wine I sold went for 13% above what I bought for 3 years 5 months ago, so not the best returns, but better than some! Also, they made a further 1-2% since valuation last November, so proof the market hasn’t crashed.
Let’s hope the cheque clears!
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Well Bob,
You must be one of their potential clients who will re-invest your “profits” and probably put in more money.
Cos I made it clear to them that I will never ever invest in wines again, and since wanting to sell my wines in early 2008. Nothing was being sold since and I choose to withdraw my wines to drink.
Lets hope your cheque clears!
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Just emailed Andrew Bassett and rec’d an out of office message that he will be in Hong Kong from 3 – 6 September and to contact his assistant if it’s an emergency. That’s over 2 months ago!
I am also a long time investor with AWI. Been trying to sell for 3 years and no luck.
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Interesting thread. I invested in some wines back in 2004, have been to the stock and also AWI’s office (in 2005). I have had nothing but trouble since then and never receive anything from them. Continous pressure does seem to help at least getting a valuation report every 2 years or so, but my wines has not really appreciated and the buy of the century was never rated by Parker JR so it has basically no value. Numerous attempts to sell has not been effected and they NEVER answer back when you want to sell…….. What a load of rubbish. I am now giving it ONE last chance and if nothing happens then I will go there and in worst case release my 150 bottles (mostly Magnums) for drinking (will last some time I believe)……
Worst is I also recommended this to some friends who ended up investing and one of them for a serious am,ount
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Andrew of AWI only knows how to avoid calls. I took a day off and caught him by surprised. Printed all the email he send to me previously and throw at him in his office, apparently got he got angry but I show my anger even he got scare. Managed to get him to write in black and white as I have got tired of all his mouth talking and empty promises. I force him to pay me everything in 1 week time and I dont care of the return but managed to get my initial invetsment back.
NEVER EVER will invest with this company again.They only call you when they want me to buy, but when I want to sell, they will give thousand of reasons to you.
I would like to warn or give my advice to all investors here that AWI basically only care of how much people buy from them, never care when investors want to sell.
So please tell all your friends or family about this company.
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Sci Reply:
March 3rd, 2010 at 11:37 pm
Hi Mike
Read the posts here on AWI with increasing worry & annoyance.. Invested with AWI in 2005 & into my 4th broker whom I received a call from him only once last year. I must say the 2nd & 3rd were the worst brokers of the 4: the 2nd broker named Ian earned a huge chunk from me (wth a bait that they had engaged a very experienced wine broker from UK to set up a division to sell off the wines in a few months’ time then) & subsequently heard that he left for HK; while after a year, the 3rd broker called – twice in fact (forgotten he had called to introduce himself earlier) & babbled throughout leaving me no impression of his name!! Ever told off the 3rd & 4th brokers that I would not invest anymore unless I see my investments being liquidated 1st!!! Guess both vanished into thin air after hearing that.
Hence, can share how much did you invest with them? Would like to gauge what are my chances of getting my monies back if I were to adopt your method of storming into their office..
Many thanks in advance!
Sci
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Robert Rees Reply:
March 5th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
Sci
We have helped some people to sell their wines here in Singapore through our company Wine Exchange Asia. I can be of assistance please let me know.
You can reach me on robert@wineexchangeasia.com
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Ann Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 11:26 pm
Hi Mike,
Can you offer me any advices that how can i get back my inital investment back?
Thanks
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Robert Rees Reply:
August 7th, 2010 at 9:58 am
Anna
Please email me at the email above and I will happilly evaluate the wines for you. We are helpoing a number of AWI clients to sell.
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Just did a Google search on Andrew Bassett and realized that he has been blatantly lying to the public by claiming that “one should never lose money by investing in fine wine”. This was mentioned in his video interview on CNBC in July 2009, right in the time frame when he was using the excuse that market is down and I would have to sell my wine at a loss.
Andrew Bassett has such a bad reputation and personal integrity that not only will I not invest with AWI again, but I will avoid any company with the name Andrew Bassett in it.
All the complaints and bad experiences we have had (and related on this board) clearly shows that what Andrew Bassett of Australian Wine Index mentions in the press about the promise of fine wine investment is clearly misrepresented, to say the least. It is deceptive and misleading in actuality.
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Oh dear, yet another case of foreign sharks coming in to feed on local guppies. When is our caring mentor going to use his superior intellect to safeguard his charges?
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I have read with concern the notes left on this blog. I manage a Wine platform – Wine Exchange Asia here in Singapore. One of our most popular platforms of sale is our Singapore Live Market page which enables owners of wine to advertise ther wines for sale to our database of some 3000 customers here in Singapore. I would be happy to evaluate any of the wines which you own and assist in the sale of them.
Looking forward to hearing from you.
Robert Rees
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Seem like everyone went for a break on CNY. Basically, I’m very unhappy with AWI too & won’t recommend anyone to invest with them.
I started in 2005 thinking it will be a good investment fr all the info given by the broker but only to realize is a “scam”. They are so prompt in getting you to buy the wine but when come to trading it off, is a nightmare. They gave all sort of reasons and even the valuation get delay a few times and they still dare to say because due to RPJ delay when RPJ don’t evaluation Australian wine anymore.
And indeed Andrew is one big liar. He told me my wine trade is going well and promised to call me back but the next thing I know the whole company went on 2 weeks holidays leave at year end. Tried to email him and got scolded in the the email. I would say is a very bad expirence with AWI.
So do beware …
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Yes . AWI is a nightmare, do not invest with them. Andrew is just a terrible shit idiot, he always tried to avoid and dont even return email or answer the call.I have waited so long for my wines to trade off, until now……0.
Yes indeed they are changing brokers, the turnover rates are faster then Mcdonald, beware all investors.They will always ask to buy buy buy, but when sell, they will drag drag drag drag drag drag drag.
I have been to a few of their tasting and seems like the boss is no longer there, fishy company.
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Caleb Reply:
March 5th, 2010 at 11:47 am
Hi Mike,
you mean Jeremy Kasler no longer the CEO? So who is in-charged now? Can we all join up to do anything against them?
Thanks.
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Yes,i also heard AWI Jeremy and Andrew is currently closely being monitor by the relevant department, too many complaint on them. Hope the relevant department will sort them out fast before something similar with UAG turnout.
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Caleb Reply:
March 7th, 2010 at 11:05 pm
Hi Paul,
which relevant dept have you contacted? Thanks.
Regards,
Caleb
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CAD , consumer , MOM . I have received too many calls and email from diffrent brokers, I wonder if these foreign workers do have permit to work here. I will just complaint to which ever department , i dont care and i want my money back.
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Ann Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 1:41 pm
Yes, mike. You are right!
But do these things work? Anything improve when you report to CASE, CAD and MOM?
is it possible to leave your email to me and i would like to contact you directly.
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is their any progress being made with all of this? I have reported to CAD, asked the MOM to validate the foreign workers there too.
I saw AWI at the BOat Asia yesterday and asked one of their foreigners to expalin it to me. he had stories that I can sell a wine I bought today in less than a year! I asked him why I cannot do that with my wines that I have with AWI? I was told to speak to my own broker about that. it is all lies! their lies are getting bigger and I do not see anyone stopping this from happening to more and more people.
I spoke with my son, and he suggested we for AWI on FACEBOOK, then paople can join. this company needs more negative publicity than it already has – they are still operating every day, tricking more people to invest, with no way out.
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http://www.facebook.com/pages/why-wont-Australian-Wine-Index-Singapore-try-to-sell-my-wines/111957718835318?created
JOIN THIS PAGE, TELL YOUR FRIENDS TO. WE HAVE TO JOIN TOGETHER TO MAKE SOME THING HAPPEN FOR US.
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Ann Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 1:34 pm
I already joined but few people respond
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I invested with AWI in 2004.
For 3 years I have to sell my portfolio, nobody will ever return calls, valuation delayed. Being frustrated with Andrew Bassett’s unwillingness to take my calls, I went his office without appointment, he promised to take immediate action and sell within 2 weeks, nothing happened.
Andrew no longer takes my calls, am being referred to Stewart now, he does not call back either.
Must be terrible for the Singaporeans working in that office !
Would any of you be interested in teaming up to seek solutions to recover as much as possible of our investments.
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Caleb Reply:
April 29th, 2010 at 4:50 pm
Yes Luffe, I have the same experience. The only way to get them is to keep calling their office line and they will never return call even if u leave your nos.
I have made an appointment with them to talk face to face but I doubt it will make much different, I just want to scold them. I think a better solution is to get a wine dealer to sell off our wine in bulk hope that will recover our cost.
Lets rally more people here.
Aside to Angry Mr. Tan, I don’t think u have created a group in facebook as there’s no join button, only a like button.
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Robert Rees Reply:
April 30th, 2010 at 9:46 am
Hi Caleb
We are helping some wine investors sell their holdings. Should you be interested please feel free to contact myself at the email detailed above.
Robert
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Caleb Reply:
April 30th, 2010 at 10:11 am
Hi Robert,
I have contacted you before but some of the prices you quoted for the wines are half the price I paid for. If you can give us a better valuation it will be good.
Thanks,
Caleb
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Robert Rees Reply:
April 30th, 2010 at 9:47 am
Luffe
We have been helping some investors to sell their holdings. Should you be interested feel free to contact me at my email above.
Robert
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richard Reply:
August 6th, 2010 at 7:31 pm
Robert,
I have invested in AWI since 2004 and like many others they could not get rid of my portfolio. I am keen to sell it. Let me know if you can help to sell it.
Richard
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Pathetic Reply:
June 8th, 2010 at 12:11 pm
Terrible for the Singaporeans working in that office? No one is forcing the poor helpless Singaporeans to work there. In fact many of the brokers who have been ripping you all off are Singaporeans!
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Hi
We should gather as many frustrated AWI’s investors (like me) as possible, to come together to think of a way out.. If successful, good for us. Otherwise, we still have our wines in the cellars. No matter what, at least we create the awareness for others & get AWI’s name stained or out from Singapore in the process..
Anyone keen to join in?
Sci
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Ann Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 6:22 pm
Yes, sci. I am keen to join! How can I get in touch with u? I think consumer protection law in SIngapore is very sound n we should seek government assistance if necessary.
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Yes I am keen to join in.
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Steph Reply:
June 14th, 2010 at 2:16 pm
Yes. Keen.
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They are now trying to sell 2008/9 Hewitson Private Cellar, offer price SGD158/bottle release price ~SGD296/bottle
You gain SGD 138/bottle immediately when the wine is released
how likely is that?
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Sci Reply:
May 20th, 2010 at 9:39 pm
Let them know that you would like to reserve a put option now & cash out the gain when the wine is released.. *) Never leave your $$$ with AWI unless you’ve too much!! But I felt if that’s the case, why not make donations to the charities whereby one can earn good karma instead of funding their lavish lifestyle.
Anyway, I’ve registered a Facebook group called “Frustrated AWI Investors” whereby we, victims of AWI, can come together & think of ways out of our curent plight. With the power of the masses, we’ll definitely work things out. Due my current workload, hopefully, I can extend my invitation here soon. Look out for it..
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Ann Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 1:46 pm
Hi Sci,
I tried but i could not find these group in facebook. Can you upload pagelink?
I think most of us are quite busy with our job and we do not have enough time to “play game” these brokers. Can we launch a campaign against them? Shall we organise a meeting to discuss how to solve this problem face to face?
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Do all the Wine investment companies in Singapore act like AWI?
As far as wine investments concerned ?
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Hi all, read through all the comments here with great concern; like some here, was actually considering investing in AWI. Thank goodness I decided to look for more info on them first!
From the experience of everyone here, can anyone say “Ponzi scheme?” Really smells like one here.
Has anyone reported them to CASE or the MTI? Hopefully they would swoop in on these fraudulent bait-n-switch “fishermen”.
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hi does anyone here know that saeed shah is now with premium liquid asset???? i bought wine with him in awi
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I hear that the brokers at AWI that almost all of their brokers ahve left! they have filled themselves with innocent people money, then moved to hong kong and other companies now in singapore.
also, I went to DP Bureau to check out AWI. their capital structure is worth S$100. that is it! so if you can sue company, that is maximum amount you can get, right?
this is scary scary. the DP bureau document shows Kasler as a secretary and Bassett as the director owning 100% of the company – it also has his address. june 5 & 6 AWI at SUNTEC FOR INVESTMENT FAIR. they are doing talk also.
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Yes, they are still active in the investment fair, http://www.asiainvestment.com.sg/index.htm.
Recently, they hired 2 more ang mo Staurt & David to look after the trading and liaising with clients and to address the compliants. But things are still moving very slow, they are still not getting enough markets to sell our wines.
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stuart does not work anymore, he quitted already. and david is a timeshare man. he know sh!t about wine … same as us!!!
almost 10 staff leave from end march, many broker and other staff. I hear story that their accountant has left also…
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This is all very disturbing. I have been trying to sell my investment with AWI for a while too. Keep getting excuses like the report is not out, etc. When the report was finally out with much delay, and I indicated my intent to sell, even at a lost, I received a lot of excuses like this is not a good time to sell etc. Shouldn’t that be left to the investor’s own discretion?
Anyway, is there only AWI that can sell our investment for us? No other companies out there?
In the sad event that we really withdraw our own wine to drink, do we have to pay taxes?
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Robert Rees Reply:
June 15th, 2010 at 9:49 am
Steph
We have been helping a number of people with evaluation and sale of ther wines. Contact me at robert@wineexchangeasia.com and I will be happy to advise.
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Steph
Yes, you have to pay taxes to withdraw the wine.
No, AWI is not going to sell your wine. Everything you’ve gone through, I have personally gone through – indicating intent to sell for 2 whole freaking years, and I have withdrawn and drank my wines. Andrew Bassett train wreck of an unscrupulous cheat is still giving talks on wine investments.
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Hi all,
I’m also one of the many “unfortunate” to have put $ in the hands of AWI.
Today I just found out that i have got the third broker since signed up with AWI barely a year ago. Like what has been shown in many threads, the broker used many excuses to avoid my request to sell off the wines. He said i’m not allowed to sell at all for the first three years! Not sure if anyone has encountered the same before.
He also promised to send me the valuation report within the day, but as expected it did not materialize.
Just did a check on Langton site, the closest match to the wine that I bought is only abt $80~90 per bottle whereas i purchased
them $132 per bottle! Seriously feel that AWI did not really reveal the true worth of the wine prior to sign-up.
Has anyone lodged complaint to CASE before? Do you think it is useful? I strongly believe something has to be done to stop AWI from fooling more innocent investors!
Ann
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I think somebody can perhaps look into the basis by which they value your wines in the “valuation reports”, which are consistently delayed anyways. If there isn’t a robust mechanism or credible basis for the valuation reports, then AWI is misleading investors about the real market value of the wines.
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“Not allowed” to sell within the first three years? Or was it “not recommended”?
Do check your contract to see if “not allowed” is indeed in any clause. I think the broker just BS-ed you.
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Hi kurious,
Thanks for your kind advice. Yes, they keep cheating us. If you want to sell them, they find lots of excuses.
Shall we do any action, such as reporting to CASE, to stop them fooling us? No other legal means to solve the problem?
How about your situation. If we sell them to open market,we will definitely loss money.
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Caleb Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 2:41 pm
Is useless, seem like no one can do anything to them and that’s why they are not afraid. CASE doesn’t accept disbute on investment and wine trading is not govern by MAS. They were listed in SICC before but was removed because they didn’t pay the membership fee. I have check with SICC, they don’t regulate or govern wine investment also.
I’m curious why TV show keep on saying wine investment is good but yet is not govern or regulated by any authority. And sad to say many times to file a compliant is such a complicated task. So it seem that they have made use of this loop hole and still going free as there’re no means to even touch them.
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Saw the this disbute centre info on moneysense website, not sure if they can help.
http://www.fidrec.com.sg/website/index.html
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I have also invested with AWI, and very upset over the experience. Brokers only call to push sales, never about trading off your portfolios. Anyone managed to sell off your collections yourself? care to share your experience?
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Let’s face facts we have been sold a lie we can’t do anything to help us get our money back, we sue we get 100 dollors, our voice will only be affected if we close them down, which means telling everyone we know that they are a cowboy company, they have been smart on there contracts now we have to be smart on our campain to close them down. Words are not enough we need to take action. Contact the media, have a mass walk in off there office, show them we mean business. This forum is full of people who just share the same old story. Let’s take action now!!!!!! Every time they sell an investment they are getting richer as we lose out, the time for talking is over.. Let’s stand up to Andrew bassett it’s our hard earned money we have lost… Join me to close awi once and for good!!!!!
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alex Reply:
July 2nd, 2010 at 3:20 pm
Hi Ripped off,
i totally agree with you.
to all AWI investors, let’s take ACTION, talking and crying here will not help bring our HARD EARN MONEY BACK!
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Has anyone considered writing in to Straits Times forum?
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Ann Reply:
July 3rd, 2010 at 10:57 am
Hi all,
I agree with you!
Can we choose a day to meet up together and discuss what kind of action we can take?
I was told by a broker that this month 17-18, AWI will organize the investors to visit warehouse(althought so far i did not get formal writen letter) and has everbody here known this? If so, will everybody here attend? It is a good opportunity to meet up together.
Hi others,
Pls take action against them.
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Hi all,
Have you guys received their email about warehouse visiting on this 17 and 18?
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alex Reply:
July 13th, 2010 at 9:48 am
Nope, i didn’t received their email.
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Caleb Reply:
July 13th, 2010 at 10:16 am
Hi Ann,
I didn’t hear about it. If your broker told u this then arrange with him. Maybe make it Sat morn and we can all meet there.
Thanks.
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AWI said that there isn’t any such organised visit to the warehouse…. If I’m interested to visit my wine at the warehouse, I can send in my request and they can arrange it. So I guess it’s more of an individual visit rather than a ‘planned’ group trip?
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Does individual visit means they can show the same bottle of wine to everybody visiting at separate times and tell them that that bottle belongs to all of them at different times?
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Ann Reply:
July 13th, 2010 at 11:10 pm
Hi Steph, Alex and Caleb
You can send them your request or call your broker to see whether they can arrange time for you. Do not worry, it is their duty to show the bottles belongs to you. I do think it is better to see your physical assets rather than get “paper” gain.
Hi Step and Singaporean,
i think yourguys’ concerns are correct. It’s more of an individual visit rather than a ‘planned’ group trip. Do not know whether they show the same bottle at separate times to different people.
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Caleb Reply:
July 14th, 2010 at 9:46 am
Hi Ann,
I have contacted Melo logistic before & they confirmed that the wines are physically there. They can also show us the wine and record of shipping doc. Thus, we can actually liaise with them directly.
I use to contact Jamie, Lim.Siew2@menloworldwide.com but she transferred to another dept. There’s another contact in the email list but so far that person just let Jamie do the replying. Maybe you people can try Md Ariff, MDAriff.Afifah@menloworldwide.com.
Thanks,
Caleb
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alex Reply:
July 14th, 2010 at 2:35 pm
is better to arrange with Menlo directly. i have done that so far as my brokers are not always at Menlo during my visit even though i have requested them to be there.
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Are they selling these wines now ?
1) 2005 & 2006 Elderton Command Shiraz for $1140/case
2) 2008 Mount Mary Quintet Cabernet Blend for $2214/case
Does anyone know if 2008 Mount Mary Quintet Cabernet Blend is real ?
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Hi Caleb,
Tks for your suggestion. So far we did not visit Menlo since they have changed visiting time to August.
So if i liaise with Menlo people directly to arrange time to visit my wines, what kind of documents we should show to them? Any direct telephone number available?
Tks a lot!
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alex Reply:
July 21st, 2010 at 10:38 am
Hi Ann,
you can call Afifah @ 6499 7247 to arrange for a visiting appointment.
Just tell her your AWI client number and the visiting schedule will do.
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Hi Alex,
Thanks a lot for your kind advice!
Ann
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All,
I sufferred the same fate as most of you. I invested in 2004 and 2005. I called and complained but till today, they could not sell any of my wines.
Lately, they have a new trading manager and his name is David. He said that AWI is now helping their customers to trade on online wine exchanges in London and Australia. The last I heard from him was 3 weeks ago and he said he could try to see if my portfolio attracts any bid in Australia.
I am not optimistic.
Do you know that you have to pay 7% GST and another 14% tax to take out the wine to drink? ie 21% immediate loss.
I suggest we set up a fund to seek legal advise.
Any comment?
Richard
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Hi rechard, I totally agree with u! Besides thus, they always postpone the schedule of wine visiting. They r not responsible at all!
How can we get together to find out what kind of method we can take?
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I have quite a big investment with AWI and I am getting suspicious after reading all these posts. The broker showed me high prices for those wine which I bought but I realized they are not worth so much afterall. Can we take action against them for misrepresentation?
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Hi Donut,
Yes, i agree that the brokers in AWI mislead us to invest money on wines, which are not worth so much. But how can we show evidence that they did misrepresentation? In law, we must proof they misleading us. Besides, as others mentioned, investing on wine is NOT protected by regulation of MAS. I really do not know what kind of action we can take and i am so surprised why AWI has been operating in Singapore for 7 years if it is unable to sell good price of customers wine as they promised. I think the way they make money is to induce new clients to invest with them and as for the exsiting clients like us, they always refuse to sell by using thousands of excuses due to unfavourable wine market condition. Do not believe any “paper gain” , it is useless. The actual gain is much convinced.
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Alvin Lim is going to speak at Invest Fair again. Shall we go down?
http://www.investfair.com.sg/seminars.html
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Ann and all,
It is strange that nobody really kick a big fuss in these 7 years.
Perhaps wine investment companies are only interested in the BIG guns, ie, those who buy and sell frequently. If we are not buying new wines, they will not sell our ex-stocks. It is like a “one in, one out” kind of deal. The BIG guns made money and they are not complaining (of course, they may be dwelling in deeper). Only SMALL fishes like us are jumping! Sob : ( !!!
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